new builder

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ddoutthere
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new builder

Post by ddoutthere » April 7th, 2021, 6:38 pm

Hello my name is Dave Davis. Thank you for letting me into the group. I live in the Black Hills of SD. I have been Smoking Meat for 20 plus years. I decided some time ago to build one and am just now getting it done. I have smoked most of the standard fare. Pork butts, Turkeys, Ribs, and have occasionally cooked up a brisket. I use to smoke venison Salami as I am a hunter as well. I just discovered the tri-tip. I use wood and lump charcoal. I use to use all wood but with my small smoker found it is easier to mix with charcoal.
I am looking for some help with my build as I am not sure my theory will work. I have a good Idea it will and I believe I can make it. I will put pictures on to help visualize what I want to make. The best way I can describe it would be a vertical smoker with an offset fire box. It is going to be stainless steel, at least on the outside. I have been collecting parts for some time now and have finally started with the build. I want to insulate it except the lid and fire box. I was going to insulate the firebox but have decided not to as I have heaver stainless for the box.
Me Idea was to put the fire box on the side to make it easier to tend the fire. My small smoker takes a considerable amount of tending especially if I use just wood. My questions are about the fire box and the throat I am guessing it is called; The hole in the bottom of the CC. How big to make both. I started with a 7x7 hole in the Bottom of the CC and I am figuring the fire box to be 16” wide x16” tall x 14” deep. 1/8” stainless with a door on the end. I will put in my pictures to help visualize.
Does the fire box sound like it will be large enough? And the hole in the bottom of the CC I can change if I need, is it sized right? Thanks again and please give me your input.
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Last edited by ddoutthere on April 14th, 2021, 11:10 am, edited 1 time in total.



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dacolson
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Re: new builder

Post by dacolson » April 7th, 2021, 6:59 pm

Really interesting setup. I would be concerned about temps on the inner cook chamber where the fb throat opens into your air gap. My guess is you’d get a big hotspot there. Have you thought about lowering the throat opening from your firebox so it’s below the bottom of your cook chamber? I would also consider putting a diffuser or baffle above the opening into your cook chamber.


Dave C - QueNorth Smokers
Farmington, MN

ddoutthere
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Re: new builder

Post by ddoutthere » April 7th, 2021, 7:36 pm

Thanks Dave. I didn't think about the hot spot. Its about 6" from the FB to the outside of the CC. I could put a baffle plate in there to help. I want to keep the FB off the ground just to keep from getting on my Knees just to ten the fire. My old smoker has the FB below the cook chamber and I have to kneel to ten that fire. That was the main reason for making the offset FB. I did plan on putting a diffuser above the opening into the CC;



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Re: new builder

Post by Big T » April 7th, 2021, 8:10 pm

Welcome aboard!! That's certainly a unique design. Do you plan on using a fan to force the heat around the entire inner cook chamber ? If not the heat will follow the path of least resistance which will probably lead to one side being hotter than the other. Of course I don't have any experience with anything similar to this so I'm really just guessing.


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Re: new builder

Post by tinspark » April 8th, 2021, 11:44 pm

Welcome,
I am wondering if a centerfeed design wouldn't be a better option. You would need a SP and might think about putting a damper in it. They are very efficient and would use almost all of the heat (almost no heat loss) so a small fire would likely be in order. Just my 2Cents. Again, welcome aboard!

Also, Here is a link on this site that helped me a little when I was deciding what to build..
viewtopic.php?f=148&t=4955&sid=f6b028ea ... f3df582ae9


Regards,
"tinspark's" build links below:
Last build-GF:https://smokerbuilder.com/forums/viewto ... 30#p114730
First build- Santa Maria Smoker:
https://smokerbuilder.com/forums/viewto ... 7a614a230a
Santa Maria Rebuild: viewtopic.php?f=17&t=7533&p=112344&hili ... 34#p112344

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Re: new builder

Post by tinspark » April 8th, 2021, 11:45 pm

tinspark wrote:
April 8th, 2021, 11:44 pm
Welcome,
I am wondering if a centerfeed design (vertical smoker) wouldn't be a better option. You would need a SP and might think about putting a damper in it. They are very efficient and would use almost all of the heat (almost no heat loss) so a small fire would likely be in order. Just my 2Cents. Again, welcome aboard!

Also, Here is a link on this site that helped me a little when I was deciding what to build..
viewtopic.php?f=148&t=4955&sid=f6b028ea ... f3df582ae9


Regards,
"tinspark's" build links below:
Last build-GF:https://smokerbuilder.com/forums/viewto ... 30#p114730
First build- Santa Maria Smoker:
https://smokerbuilder.com/forums/viewto ... 7a614a230a
Santa Maria Rebuild: viewtopic.php?f=17&t=7533&p=112344&hili ... 34#p112344

ddoutthere
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Re: new builder

Post by ddoutthere » April 9th, 2021, 12:13 am

a 1" hole in the Cook chamber opposite the firebox will allow some smoke to circle the outside of the CC. I don't know how well it will work. Where would I put the fan? I had a Question abut the FB. I have refigured it to be 14"x14"x18" that comes close to 15 gal. I have looked at the calculator and been to several sites. One site said with a reverse flow vertical smoker the fire box could be from 1/4 to 1/6 the volume of the CC. I have not found a calculator for a vertical smoker fire box. I am considering insulating the FB. My CC is about 60gal



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Re: new builder

Post by Dirtytires » April 9th, 2021, 8:18 am

Interesting design.



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Re: new builder

Post by towtruck » April 9th, 2021, 1:31 pm

Welcome. As others have suggested that design may give you fits. Air flow being the biggest issue and the hot spot second. A way to feed all the heat to the center and have it diffuse upward would be my best guess to make it work right....one thing for sure is you won't need a big bed of coals to keep it at temp.

I just looked again at your plans and you are basically a center feed now.....I would directly get that hot air and smoke from the firebox to the center and diffuse it.



ddoutthere
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Re: new builder

Post by ddoutthere » April 9th, 2021, 4:09 pm

Yes the fire box is on the side but the smoke comes up the center. The problem I am hearing about here is the probable. hot spot. a plate diffuser sounds like it will help. I really want the fire box up where I can tend the fire without getting on my knees. I was going to use this as a backyard unit I could also use for grilling. Just put a plate on the bottom rack and a grate in the CC and load with charcoal, and I have a grill. I did think of putting the FB below but it puts it at 10 inches off the ground to tend. I was also considering making the lid to the firebox the door. That would make it even easer for fire tending. Like the small offset smokers I see. It may be more difficult to seal the lid to prevent air flow with the lid opening though. The other problem would be the fire getting big every time I open the lid. I understand the more sealed I keep this the more efficient it be. I like that Idea but don't want to cut down on Smoke. and Thanks for the replies I know my plan could be a little different looking but I think with this groups knowledge! you guys will help me build a real cooker.



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Re: new builder

Post by Dirtytires » April 12th, 2021, 10:23 am

Sounds like a revolutionary design!



ddoutthere
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Re: new builder

Post by ddoutthere » April 12th, 2021, 6:02 pm

Hello Guys. Thanks for all the input. I have created a better picture to help with understanding my design Idea. It is difficult to see and draw but I have the CC inside the case. The FB is sitting outside the 3" channel and I can put a plate inside the case 12" wide X 12" tall. The plate should direct the smoke down.
sketch3.pdf[/[attachment=0]sketch3.pdf
attachment] I drew in where the wheels will go. I am better about the plan. I I am going back and forth about insulating the FB. I think I am small enough it won't make a big difference. 14" X 14" X 16" is 3136 cubic inches about 13.5 gal. I think that will give me a good size fb for this unit. I am using 1/8 stainless for that. I think it will hold up as the fire won't be to big, I use sticks mostly. about 6-8 inches long and 2-3 diameter.
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Re: new builder

Post by dacolson » April 12th, 2021, 7:28 pm

I really hope it works for you. My only thought is that it may work like a rocket stove, using the draft of the exhaust to pull heat/smoke through your cook chamber. As long as you can control the heat at the throat, it may just work out fine. I love the look.


Dave C - QueNorth Smokers
Farmington, MN

ddoutthere
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Re: new builder

Post by ddoutthere » April 14th, 2021, 1:02 pm

Thanks Dave. I hope it works well. That heat is one reason I change my mind on the Fire box so often. I tend to think the heat will be defused before it makes it to the cook chamber throat. I keep wanting to downsize the Fire box to keep the fire small, thus less Heat. On the other hand if the fire box is larger it will need less tending. I plan on putting a vent on the side of the fire box directly across from the opening into the inner shell. I don't know how efficient I want the fire box to be. The calculators all give cubic inches but shape is important also so if I go with 14" x 14" x 20" is 3920, and 14" x 16" x 18" is 4032 a difference of 112 cubic inches but I would guess the smaller one would burn better as it is closer to being a cube. From what I have read the closer to being a sphere the Fire box is, the more efficient the fire will be. That is why people go with the cylinder. the box is the best way to get cubic inches in a smaller diameter. I would need a 16 inch cylinder to equal a 14" box it would look cooler but be harder to deal with building. So back to my big question how big a fire box should I build? I was 14" x14" if I add 2 inches in height will it make it work better?



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